1. It is often said in Indian mysticism that the universe is created out of sound. Physicists believe that the universe is created out of vibrations. Accordingly to mystics, what is the difference between sound and vibration? In physics, propagation of sound requires a material medium to exist whereas vibration is a lot more subtle.
2. Several mystics have claimed that Indians knew about the value of speed of light long before its discovery by modern scientists. Though this could be true, modern physics goes much further and says that nothing in this universe can travel faster than the speed of light in vacuum. In fact, all theories of modern physics are based on this key assumption. What does mysticism have to say about this? In the physical dimensions, can something travel faster than light?
3. String theory predicts that our space has many more dimensions than the 3 that we normally perceive. How are non-physical dimensions, that mysticism often refers to, different from these additional physical ones? Are non-physical dimensions also governed by objective laws?
4. The process of consecration is said to be about a certain kind of energisation of mundane objects. But the physical energy of the mundane object does not seem to increase in the process as it neither starts traveling faster nor does it get hotter. This means that, according to mysticism, non-physical energy can be bound to physical dimensions without any net transfer of energy. But is it also possible for energy to be transferred from non-physical to physical dimensions? If yes, this would violate the physical principle of conservation of energy.
5. Is there any physical basis for the origin of the primordial sound AUM (or, OM) or does it originate in the non-physical dimensions? Does the sound AUM have any physical properties that make it so special and unique? In other words, if we record the sound AUM uttered by a perfect being, will we get an audio signal with some unique statistical properties?
1. Yes, I agree the Universe is made of vibrations. Sound is just a vibration which we can hear.
ReplyDelete2. As per Indian mysticism, the fastest vibration is the vibration of thought and it can travel much faster than light. I will give you a personal example. Once I was (in India) on a skype call with a meditation trainer (in the US). As soon as he said – please start meditation, I felt as if my body could feel a force field of vibrations. So, thought has pretty good speed. Just that it hasn’t been measured.
People have started working on measuring the vibrations of thoughts but the research has not yet come mainstream.
3. The fourth dimension as also known by science is the dimension of time. Science has not found all the objective laws which work here, but I can give you an example to show the similarity.
For instance,
Science - Frequency is inverse of time period.
Mysticism - Lower the frequency of our existence (can be reduced by meditation), we experience more time in the same moment (which you can call a higher level of consciousness).
There are many other concepts in our Vedas. Just that we haven’t given formulas in the Vedas so that people don’t misuse them.
5. As per some Indian systems, the world has originated from the center. Centre – in my limited understanding is a term for the vibration of nothingness. But, the Center’s vibrations started colliding and converting into grosser forms – like OM. After many collisions, this energy converted into even grosser forms like matter which we see now. So, OM is not the origin.
4. No, there is no net energy transfer. You can consider this charging as aligning of vibration force fields in a particular fashion. When a mystic transmits energy(vibrations) to a person (using his thought vibration), he does not add new energy into the person. He just aligns that person’s vibration field to the fundamental vibration field of the center (nothingness). The mystic is just a tuning fork which has come in resonance with the center. And he is using his thought power(vibration) to align your vibrations to the same center. Same is the case in charging, so you don’t find hotness or speed.
Also, I have known of a scientific study where the brain mapping was done and the change in vibration of the brain was measured, before and after meditation. But still, the best equipment to observe these changes is the human body for the moment.
Thanks a lot for the comments!
Delete> As per Indian mysticism, the fastest vibration is the vibration
> of thought and it can travel much faster than light.
That could be true, but mysticism may be referring to transport in the non-physical dimensions. In the physical brain, thoughts are just patterns of electric and magnetic fields, which travel at the speed of light or lesser depending on the medium.
> Science - Frequency is inverse of time period.
> Mysticism - Lower the frequency of our existence (can be reduced by meditation),
> we experience more time in the same moment
Thats not a good comparison. Change of time-period is not same as change of "time" itself. Also, I also don't think there is any reference to the physical concept of frequency (or its reduction) in our scriptures. Thats just loose language used by some mystics nowadays.
> So, OM is not the origin.
Om is considered to be the most fundamental among all cosmic vibrations. And if we believe that the world has been created by vibrations, then Om is the origin.
> No, there is no net energy transfer. You can consider this charging as aligning of vibration force fields in a particular fashion.
Alignment of force fields requires work to be done which can lead to transfer of energy (potential energy).
Dear Dr Shah,
ReplyDelete1. There is no difference in vibration and sound. In fact, sound exists in the form of vibration. Vibration when felt by a medium, it is heard like sound. If there is no media, it is only vibration.
2. I agree with the comment that thought is faster than light. i wd like to go a step beyond; it is consciousness which is even faster than thought and in fact consciousness is a continuous web, so there is no question even of distance or speed.
3 & 4. The dimensions in spirituality or mysticism are-Bliss or the soul; consciousness; Intellect or thought; Energy or pran and Matter. Science so far has explored only two dimensions that is matter and energy. While converting matter into energy is simple, converting energy into matter is difficult. That was the step in the process of creation. The five dimensions also correspond to the panch-koshas or the five sheaths.
5. In fact 'Aum' is also a representative sound. In fact it is the sound of the heart beat-Anahat Naad, which exists or is reproduced in every cell of all living beings and also in the non-beings. One cannot say what this sound is like so people have said it differently, like Aum, Hoo etc. This sound exists as a symbol of and obedience in the entire creation. Following the path of this sound, one can go back to the source i.e. the Creator.
These are brief comments.
Warm Regards,
RKGupta
Thanks a lot for your comments, Mr. Gupta!
Delete> it is consciousness which is even faster than thought and
> in fact consciousness is a continuous web, so there is no
> question even of distance or speed.
Yes, I tend to agree. But that is again in the non-physical domain. Do our scriptures also say something about the maximum possible speed in the physical domain?
> In fact 'Aum' is also a representative sound. In fact it is the
> sound of the heart beat-Anahat Naad, which exists or
> is reproduced in every cell of all living beings and also
> in the non-beings. One cannot say what this sound is like so
> people have said it differently, like Aum, Hoo etc.
Thats an interesting point! So are you essentially saying that there is nothing unique about Aum and there can be other ways of referring to this cosmic sound?
Thanks,
Kushal.
>Yes, I tend to agree. But that is again in the non-physical domain. Do our scriptures also say something about the maximum possible speed in the physical domain?
ReplyDeleteThanks Kushalji. In my humble opinion there cannot be any divisions like physical domain and spiritual domain etc., it is only for the sake of understanding them better that a division can be considered. Matter, energy, intellect, consciousness and bliss cannot be separated, these all are present in every being in the universe. So depending upon which dimension is strong, one may be influenced by those characteristics.
>Thats an interesting point! So are you essentially saying that there is nothing unique about Aum and there can be other ways of referring to this cosmic sound?
This cosmic sound cannot be translated in language, it is unique. Every word has a unique sound, so does 'Aum', 'Allah-hoo' and so on. And none of these sounds are destroyed, there may be intereference but no destruction. So if the sound is strong (mentally or through thought), it affects the cosmos. 'Aum' recited with clean heart (mentally or physically) would have a different effect than "Aum" recited without conviction. This is my feeling and understanding.
> In my humble opinion there cannot be any divisions
Delete> like physical domain and spiritual domain etc.
Guptaji, in that case, you are essentially saying that the most fundamental assumption of modern physics is wrong and that there is no upper limit to the speed of travel.
Thanks,
Kushal.
It depends; speed of what. Matter would have limitations and so wd the speed of the matter. As the form progresses, from matter to energy, energy to intellect to consciousness, the speed wd lose relevance. We know of the term-‘Param Gati’ referred to the Divine, which means absolute speed, that connotes everywhere every moment. That wd happen when the speed is infinite and then distance cease to exist.
ReplyDelete> It depends; speed of what. Matter would have
ReplyDelete> limitations and so wd the speed of the matter.
Guptaji, that was precisely my question! Do our scriptures or mystics say anything about the limit of speed of matter? And if there is essentially no division between the spiritual and physical dimensions, why should there be a difference between the speed limits of matter and subtler forms?
Thanks,
Kushal.
Kushalji, let the matter get absorbed in its origin or source and it gets out of all limits, otherwise it is governed by gravity and inertia (law of karma-action in philosophical terms).
ReplyDeleteWarm Regards.
> let the matter get absorbed in its origin or source
ReplyDelete> and it gets out of all limits, otherwise it is governed by gravity and inertia
Guptaji, that is what I am trying to understand: What is actually the law of gravity and inertia? Modern science has given us equations regarding these phenomenon. But what do our scriptures and mystics say about this? Coming back to my original question : Can matter travel faster than the speed of light?
Thanks,
Kushal.
Yes Kushalji, if there is no external force, including gravitational force acting on it.
ReplyDeleteGuptaji, can you please give me a concrete reason and/or a reference for your statement?
DeleteThanks,
Kushal.
Iam giving an explanation how the creation took place. Hope it gives the answer. it is from my book 'The Science & Philosophy of Spirituality'.
ReplyDeleteThe Almighty God, overwhelming with bliss, all of a sudden, thought of revealing Himself in the form of manifold existence in order that the manifold existence may also enjoy the same state of bliss. The Hindu scriptures mention that ‘before the creation, there was only the God, the soul of all souls. Neither there was anything to be seen, nor any seer. He Himself was the manifold existence that is seen in the created world, as He desired to be alone’ (Srimadbhagwat Mahapuran-Tratiya Skandh, Adhyay 5 Shloka 23). The sages and seers consider this world to have been created in accordance with the principle ‘Ekoaham-Mosyaam’ meaning thereby that ‘I am One, I should become manifold’. The Islamic tradition supports this in the famous Hadith; “I was a hidden treasure. I desired to be known and hence I created the world so that I should be known.”
The desire of the God constituted a two-dimensional plane. The two dimensions were constituted by the two aspects of the God’s desire, the first aspect being to multiply i.e. to become the manifold creation and the second aspect being the state of bliss enjoyed by the God to be enjoyed by the manifold creation. These two aspects were not unidirectional. The aspect of creation meant manifold existence, which involved separation from the Origin, whereas the aspect of bliss involved union with the Origin, as anything separated from its origin would always long for the unity and can become full of bliss only on removal of this feeling of separation. A piece of stone thrown in the sky rests at peace only on getting back to the earth, to which it belongs. Similarly, a stream of water constantly endeavors to rush and reunite with the ocean, from where it originated. This is the universal law that one rests at peace only on reuniting with its origin.
The scriptures mention that being the Supreme Consciousness and the treasure house of all knowledge, the God creates the world by His mere thought, which reflects in the form of Cosmic Intelligence and sets in the process of creation. The Holy Qur’an mentions;
‘Verily, when He intends a thing, His command is: Be! And it is’-Qur’an, 36:82. The Holy Bible also mentions in Genesis, Chapter 1 the command of the God as ‘let there be’ and ‘it was so’.
Similarly, it is mentioned in the Srimadbhagwat Mahapuran-Pratham Skandh Adhyay 3 Shloka 1 that “in the beginning of the creation, the God desired to create the universe and at once He revealed Himself in the form of the Adipurusha accompanied with ‘Mahtatva’ (‘Chitta’ or the faculty of thought) etc. at His command.”
The Adipurusha (Satpurusha, as He is referred to in most of the scriptures) accepted the condition of the Adimaya in order to create the world. He started to look around, but there was nothing to be seen, as He Himself was the all encompassing shining self. This very faculty of differentiating the Seer from the scene (or the RELATIVITY) was the first manifestation of the ‘Karya Kaaranrupi Maya’ (Maya in the form of cause and effect), with the help of which the God created the world.
This desire of the Divine, therefore, consisted of two opposing ends that of separation from the source and uniting back with it. The entire creation emulates this dual perception and arises from two opposing or mutually opposite complementarities. It is like a circle, which begins and ends at the same point. The point of beginning is the end of ending and the point of ending is the start of beginning. The two extremities thus originate from the same source but result in an expression of outward flow, the creation.
Thanks Guptaji for the beautiful description! But I am not able to see a connection with the question regarding speed of matter. Can you please explain the idea in this context?
DeleteThanks,
Kushal.
Dear Kushalji,
ReplyDeleteThe explanation is simple. What I am trying to say is that everything has originated from AN ORIGINAL SOURCE, you may call it God or by whatever name one wishes to. This creation, philosophically has descended as follows-Bliss (or the soul), consciousness, intellect, energy and finally matter. Every existence has the seed (or the essence) of its immediate preceding dimension and therefore of all. Thus the more condensed the state (matter being the most condensed), it has more limitation. As it moves towards the Original state, more and more free it is.
Now let me explain through an example. We all well know the electric bulb. The element is matter but when heated, light is produced, which travels at the speed of light. Now if there was a possibility of moving from energy to intellect (or thought or consciousness), one can experience that phenomena also and know about its speed.
Warm Regards,
RKG
Thanks Guptaji! I think I now follow what you are saying. Sounds quite interesting. :)
DeleteThanks.May the Almighty bless you.
ReplyDeleteWarm regards,
RKGupta
Thanks once again! :)
DeleteSome interesting comments received over email:
ReplyDelete1. Barring pure soul / pure consciousness, nothing is non-material. Both Samkhya & Vedanta proclaim that. In fact, Manas (mind), Buddhi (intellect) & Ahamkara (ego) are matters only, according to Vedanta. Therefore, all dimensions (7 upper & 7 lower) are also material or physical and not non-material.
2. When Sri Ramakrishna found Vivekananda fit enough to receive his energy, he transferred the same during his last days. Since a human is not a mundane object, his energy level after said transfer may not yet be verifiable. For a mundane object, however, such additional input is verifiable. A word of caution here. There is difference between transfer of sentient energy derived from consciousness and transfer of insentient energy that thermodynamics deals with. Energisation through consecration belongs to the former category.
3. According to the Vedanta, when the three Gunas viz. Sattva, Rajas & Tamas, are in perfect equilibrium, there is no vibration (Spandan) and there is no creation / evolution. When the said equilibrium is breached by the choice of Pure Consciousness (Brahman), creation / evolution results. Thus the Vedantists posit that Brahman evolves into myriad forms and also involves by withdrawing ITS myriad forms. Spandan or vibration signals ongoing evolution, while stoppage of vibration would mean involution or dissolution, or in other words, return to the state of perfect equilibrium. Mystics have described the sound of said cosmic vibration as AUM. Thus, in answer to your first poser, it is affirmed that AUM is the primordial as also ongoing sound of cosmic vibration and no distinction can be made in this case between the sound and the vibration, which are concomitant.
continued...
Delete4. The statement on the speed of light appears in the great commentary of Sayana on the Rigveda (I do not remember the exact reference) where he mentions that it is "indeed said that the the rays from the Sun take so many seconds to cross so many yojanas". And if the measure of yojana and also the measure of nimesha are interpreted suitably, this would translate to a number which is close to the speed of light as we know today. But the point is that Sayana's commentary was written in the 14th century, and the first measurement of light was performed in the 17th century. So we really do not know the sources for the estimate given by Sayana. It is quiet likely there were other measurements by Europeans which was brought by the portuguese traders to India. To the extent that I know, there is no other mention in any other astronomical text all the way fro Aryabhatiyam which was written in the 4th century AD.
5. It is my understanding that the word OM meant OK, or begin, in the Vedic period, a word of assent in all rituals. We have statements like Om pranaya, when the priest called Brahman informs another priest called Adhvaryu that he may proceed. However, the Mimamsaka school that flourished in India noticed, by virtue of consistency, that, if the truths of the Vedas are eternal (sanatana), then the Vedas would neither have a beginning nor an end, they would be existent, independent of any agency, even when the world is in a state which is not manifest. For this reason, the words of the Vedas acquire a special status, not accorded to ordinary words. In particular, frequently used words such as Om, Vat, Vashat all became to be considered to have great prowess. This is not entirely a theoretical construction since the Upanishads declare that the ultimate truth, the Parabrahman may indeed be meditated as Om. Thus mysticism involves superimpositions that help us comprehend the Truth. The superimpositions are necessarily constructions, but the realisation is real. To wind up this long winding ramble, the mantras of the Vedas have a dual significance. First, their very utterance, in a proper manner in a proper setting, has a great power as seen in all the rituals. The other significance, which transcends the earlier one, is in meditation where you contemplate on the deity, by various superimpositions, through the mystic words. The transcendent interpretation is, however, that all these are representations of that ultimate reality, very convenient but nevertheless mere representations. The eternal nature of the Vedas is in the eternal nature of the knowledge that they impart. And this knowledge, by the injunctions of all sages, is that which can be obtained neither by external observation nor by inference. That does not mean that inference should not be employed. It should indeed be, but only for a proper understanding of the Vedas. The sages also declare, in the same breath, that the Vedas have no specific interest in imparting any knowledge that can be obtained from observation, experiment and inference. All such secular activities are God"s gift to humanity for us to pursue and develop. The ultimate truth which is beyond this secular activity is of course purely within the realm of the Vedas.